[edgie]

As someone who has always worn a poppy
Including to Celtic matches, I wear it for my reasons not because tony Blair decided to get the media involved in the blatant politicisation of the who thing.
I will stick to my guns

BUT I cant accept tht its used as a stick to hit celtic with every year, a bit like the big john knew stuff
It reflects more on those who use it as a stick than those they are trying to beat with it ...snide and shitty behavour

[St Charles Owl]

" the poppy is to remember those who have fallen in battle, not to fight for a cause that doesn’t even involve a war!! "


Buts its ok to use it to honour illegal wars.

Sometimes I wonder how previous generations managed without the poppy. In my humble opinion,war and the military is now such a big part of the UKs economy that the government have to conflate all conflicts with the poppy now. Its good business.

Its miles away from what it was originally meant to represent. Miles. Charities like Erskine and Poppy Scotland actually do a lot of great work and I always try and support them,but there is a rebranding process going on now that the world war 2 veterans are dying off  and its using an overt nationalism I find a bit troubling.

The Poppy doesn't honor any war as such, it honors those who have fallen in wars, irrespective of the politics behind those wars. You are right all this peripheral crap surrounding who does or doesn't wear it detracts from the reason for the poppy in the first place. By buying a poppy you are supporting the Royal British Legion raise money to help veterans and their families in so many ways, irrespective of why they need that help nor what war they fought in or even if they never actually served during a war.

[0762]

I just wanna add another brief comment that you can ponder on re the 'gesture' of altering the red poppy to one with Catalan yellow stripes in solidarity although I do agree, as intimated in one of my previous threads. it is not an apolitical action. Many hundreds n hundreds of Catalans were killed or murdered in their fight against Franco's fascist regime during the period of WW2 and also post WW2. Many of these 'fallen fighters' were buried in unmarked graves and, to this day, the Spanish govt has never formally acknowledged these atrocities and taken appropriate action to locate the graves of people who they still regard as their enemies - that's one of many reasons why many Catalans, and other international sympathisers who watched the anti fascist International Brigade experience similar treatment on occasions during the Spanish civil war, regard the whole issue as a very emotive one and rightly so! The current situ leaves a 'very bad taste in the mouth' TBF and IMO the defacing of the red poppy in such a way becomes nothing other than a 'minor faux pas' in the greater scheme things and as highlighted very well by hibeejim in thread #10 as being gradually 'hijacked' to represent something different and more 'troubling'. Also note buying a poppy is only one way of contributing to the British Legion. One can easily pay money into the charity boxes and even send money to the British Legion and that is what many Scots, incl myself, do to support their services these days and it is indeed all down to the individual and how one views/opines re the perceived 'evolution' of the red poppy and what it actually represents.

[ritchiebaby]

For my own part, I wear a red poppy on Armistice Day and Remembrance Sunday. Sadly in my opinion, at my local war memorial the minister took it upon herself to pray for the people seeking peace and reconciliation and a more just world. Fine sentiments indeed, but it is not what Remembrance Sunday is about. It is about remembering the dead from all nations who have died in the service of their nations, whether we agree with them or not.

Another thing that saddens me is the practice of wearing poppies weeks before the event. For me, it dilutes the effect on the day - a bit like Red Nose Day or Christmas going on for two months.

[0762]

Re 'minor irritations' on the use of the red poppy, I must say I do find the conversion of the red poppy to a trinket or piece of jewellery to be a tad irritating where vanity prevails over just displaying a poppy in the normal way instead of it becoming this adornment to match up to one's persona for weeks - very noticeable in recent times when observing certain people in the media, politics etc who wanna 'look different'!?

[St Charles Owl]

I just wanna add another brief comment that you can ponder on re the 'gesture' of altering the red poppy to one with Catalan yellow stripes in solidarity although I do agree, as intimated in one of my previous threads. it is not an apolitical action. Many hundreds n hundreds of Catalans were killed or murdered in their fight against Franco's fascist regime during the period of WW2 and also post WW2. Many of these 'fallen fighters' were buried in unmarked graves and, to this day, the Spanish govt has never formally acknowledged these atrocities and taken appropriate action to locate the graves of people who they still regard as their enemies - that's one of many reasons why many Catalans, and other international sympathisers who watched the anti fascist International Brigade experience similar treatment on occasions during the Spanish civil war, regard the whole issue as a very emotive one and rightly so!  The current situ leaves a 'very bad taste in the mouth' TBF and IMO the defacing of the red poppy in such a way becomes nothing other than a 'minor faux pas' in the greater scheme things and as highlighted very well by hibeejim in thread #10 as being gradually 'hijacked' to represent something different and more 'troubling'. Also note buying a poppy is only one way of contributing to the British Legion. One can easily pay money into the charity boxes and even send money to the British Legion and that is what many Scots, incl myself, do to support their services these days and it is indeed all down to the individual and how one views/opines re the perceived 'evolution' of the red poppy and what it actually represents.

I agree with you regarding the Catalan use, it is a minor faux pas but if it is a symbol they traditionally use to remember those who died then fine, but it shouldn't be used for a political situation as we currently see. I suppose the reason why the poppy has persisted is that I would imagine the British Legion rely on that one symbol at this one time of year to raise substantially more than any other time of year. No different from the other charities who have traditionally latched onto a particular time of year such as the Salvation Army and Xmas even though they need money all year round. Red Nose Day, Pink ribbons for breast cancer awareness have all created a specific day or time period to focus our minds towards them. As I say I haven't worn one for years but when I lived in the UK I would always at the very least buy one even if I never wore it.

[hibeejim21]

"The Poppy doesn't honor any war as such, it honors those who have fallen in wars, irrespective of the politics behind those wars"


No. This is a much more recent utilisation and ideal of what the poppy is about. Those who have fallen in these other conflicts should be remembered but not via the poppy.

For me the poppy represents the sacrifice of our men and women in the great war and world war2. End of.

[St Charles Owl]

"The Poppy doesn't honor any war as such, it honors those who have fallen in wars, irrespective of the politics behind those wars"


No. This is a much more recent utilisation and ideal of what the poppy is about. Those who have fallen in these other conflicts should be remembered but not via the poppy.

For me the poppy represents the sacrifice of our men and women in the great war and world war2. End of.

Well as the use of the poppy dates back to before WW2, its original intent was the remembrance of those who died in WW1. On that basis we have all extended its use to other conflicts down the years. Personally I have no problem using it to remember any military personnel who have been killed in the line of duty. The Royal British Legion also do not distinguish between which wars anyone was killed in, they serve to help and remember all veterans right up to the present day.

[hibeejim21]

Eh ?

The poppy wasn't "extended" in use to other conflicts down the years. It started off as remembrance for the dead and a fund raiser for those who survived the great "world" war. And then that continued when armistice day became remembrance sunday at the end of "world" war 2. The history of it is on the RBL website. It was never intended to be used every time the UK fucked up in conflicts abroad, so while I get what you are saying about RBL and wanting to help veterans up to today, that shouldn't necessarily be equated with the poppy.

[0762]

I don't have a problem with the Royal British Legion's definition of the proper use of the poppy, which is effectively what you are referring to in your threads. I do have a problem with the highly questionable activities of a warmongering country called Great Britain and the politics attached to said wars. WW1 is a classic exposure of the 'class divide' and the fact the elite, the users of innocent people, were never gonna be slaughtered - there are lotsa books written on this disgraceful subject alone and it even extended into the second world war. Arms provision is another issue, an immoral one, and, like other hypocritical countries/arms providers when it comes to preaching re proper peace initiatives, our govt is a major offender trading 'ordnance for money' and allied to their generous political contributors - blood money for the killing of innocent lives in many cases and nobody can defend this practise please!! Also there is indeed a significant link of politicising the red poppy, a hijack of its proper status and that is where millions of people like myself take issue. It is just 'convenient' for many people to ignore it and hope the issue will go away but, as hibeejim has commented in a previous thread, it is 'troubling' and even FIFA supposedly 'got it wrong' last year when they called it a political symbol that has been used to glorify war and there are many examples of that misuse by certain people in this country who have set their own warped agenda.