[spireitematt]

Donald Tusk has told the UK if the UK can't make their minds up on trade then the EU will make the UK's mind up them and says whatever terms the EU come to the UK will have to accept.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/pol...25906.html

They are also worried about filling the financial hole they will have when Britain leaves and they have been talking how to plug it. The Commission wants cuts to spending on agricultural subsidies and cohesion funds, help for poorer member states, which make 70 per cent of the EU budget. Countries are also being asked to contribute more to make up the shortfall, while other revenue raising measures such as a plastic tax have also been proposed.

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Also they are going to ban British drivers from driving in Europe because the EU will not recognise British driving licenses after we leave.

https://inews.co.uk/news/uk-driving-lice...eu-brexit/

[St Charles Owl]

Also they are going to ban British drivers from driving in Europe because the EU will not recognise British driving licenses after we leave.

https://inews.co.uk/news/uk-driving-lice...eu-brexit/

Thats a scaremongering story if ever I read one!! All countries have different rules now within the EU as to what foreign drivers need to do. For me I have to do nothing in the UK or France to drive on my US license but in Italy I have to have an interantional drivers license, so there is no actual common EU policy on it anyway. The worse case scenario is we have to go back to having an International Drivers license like we used to in the 1980/90s. There will be a lot of things that change but to say British drivers will be banned is a bit excessive!!

[theo_luddite]

Wonder who owns Fox? That would be a story for our right wing press to chase now wouldn't it? I expect they would bury it somewhere deep in the Beano.

What do you mean hang on a minute?

[hibeejim21]

'Donald Tusk has told the UK if the UK can't make their minds up on trade then the EU will make the UK's mind up them and says whatever terms the EU come to the UK will have to accept. '



This was always how it was going to play out. The EU have already said what may wants is delusional,yet she still ploughs on.

Monday is a chance for corbyn to show real leadership and commit to keeping us in a customs union with the EU. I hope he takes it.

[0762]

It is time Corbyn showed some 'backbone' but I suspect he is 'biding his time' while the Tories 'f### up' and implode and happy to see May continuing as PM, eventually taking over from a shambles of a govt but it is also post-brexit and TOO LATE!!!! I'd bet that is his real plan.

[hibeejim21]

It looks likely tomorrow that labour will announce it proposes to stay in a customs union with the EU, one that will look pretty much identical to what we have now. That position means there is finally clear water between the 2 parties policy wise on brexit with the tories proposing no customs union (an insane notion but there you go)

That means labour can support soubry and clarkes motion and potentially defeat may in parliament,which could force a general election. For that reason alone labour will likely leave it at a customs union and a long transition period for now,because the truth is that they need brexit votes to win an election.

[ritchiebaby]

Everyone from the EU side has been telling Theresa May that she can't have her cake and eat it. Even with Labour's rejigged, cobbled together Brexit plan and a customs union, it still doesn't alter the basic message - we can't cherrypick the most suitable bits about the Customs Union. Labour have no more idea than the Tories about what's the party line to keep everyone onside. It reminds me of John Major trying to keep everyone happy and failing miserably.

I voted to leave, but I'm beginning to think we should just stay, not because I've changed my mind, but because the politicians are going to make a complete arse of it (see post#70). If the UK manages to agree an acceptable deal with the EU, then we'll either reject it in the UK Parliament accompanied by the sound of grinding axes or the EU Parliament will reject it as turkeys don't vote for Christmas.

[spireitematt]

If we stay in the single market and the customs union we will still have to accept EU law and freedom of movement and still continue paying money to the EU without having a seat at the table, so it makes you wonder would it be better to stay in and have a seat at the table and reform it from within.

The EU is overdue reform and if it doesn't reform it will collapse from its own success, you can't keep using a 40+ year plus model and continue with it. Look at the NHS, it badly needs reform, you can't keep chucking money at a problem hoping it will eventually sort itself out.

When the EEC was set up it had what? 8-12 countries? It's now at 28 countries and they want to bring in another 6 countries to make it 34. There is 50 countries in Europe so if there is 34 countries in the EU then 16 countries will be outside the EU and then it will be a matter of time till all 50 countries are in the EU. More countries in the EU will also mean more money from the likes of Germany, France, Netherlands, France, Italy and Britain (if we stay)to help prop up the rest.

This is how much countries contribute and how much they get back.

UK - pays in €14.1 billion - gets back €7.0 billion
Irelands - pays in €1.7 billion - gets back €1.6 billion
Netherlands - pays in €8.4 billion - gets back €2.0 billion
Luxemburg - pays in €246 million - gets back €1.7 billion
Portugal - pays in €1.7 billion - gets back €4.9 billion
Spain - pays in €11.1 billion - gets back €11.5 billion
France - pays in €21.0 billion - gets back €13.5 billion
Belgium - pays in €5.2 billion - gets back €7.0 billion
Germany - pays in €29.1 billion - gets back €11.5 billion
Denmark - pays in €2.5 billion - gets back €1.5 billion
Sweden - pays in €4.3 billion - gets back €1.7 billion
Finland - pays in €1.9 billion - gets back €1.1 billion
Estonia - pays in €200 million - gets back €660 million
Latvia - pays in €270 million - gets back €1.1 billion
Poland - pays in €4.0 billion - gets back €17.4 billion
Lithuania - pays in €385 million - gets back €1.9 billion
Czech Republic - pays in €1.5 billion - gets back €4.4 billion
Slovakia - pays in €720 million - gets back €1.7 billion
Austria - pays in €2.9 billion - gets back €1.6 billion
Slovenia - pays in €385 million - gets back €1.1 billion
Hungary - pays in €996 million - gets back €6.6 billion
Romania - pays in €1.5 billion - gets back €6.0 billion
Italy - pays in €15.9 billion - gets back €10.7 billion
Croatia - pays in €430 million - gets back €584 million
Bulgaria - pays in €461 million - gets back €2.3 billion
Malta - pays in €76 million - gets back €255 million
Greece - pays in €2.0 billion - gets back €7.1 billion
Cyprus - pays in €161 million - gets back €273 million

[St Charles Owl]

Those numbers illustrate one of the things that is wrong with the EU. We pay in twice what we get back, and while I accept that isn’t the whole story, compare that to Hungary putting in 1 billion and getting 6.6b back!!!!! Poland pays in 4b and gets 17.4b back, why??? There seems no rhyme or reason for these numbers to be all over the place and unless someone from the EU could explain that in layman terms these numbers will always seem wrong to the ordinary man in the street!!

[0762]

I think the reason for these numbers (if they are indeed accurate!) is fairly clear - there is a 'weighting' process whereby the more affluent countries do indeed support countries that are less affluent but the main objective is to try to raise the level of financial comfort that these lesser nations/members can enjoy and eventually raise their trade expectations in the process. As said previously, there must be some level of reform to gradually evolve in the future but IMO one does not remove one's membership from that huge market place called the EU and 'cut off your nose to spite yourself' - that is just utter folly! You force change from within!