[St Charles Owl]

The UK essentially suffers from the same problem the USA has - two party politics!!. I know there are more parties in the UK, but the Government is formed from either Labour or the Tories virtually everytime. The Labour party spend far too much time on the left fringes of their policies, just like the Democrats are in danger of doing over here, and that has made them unelectable for a lot of ordinary people. Of course this will never change in either country due to the way the votes are counted and seats allocated. In the UK, FPTP doesn't give any credit to those parties in 2nd place etc, in the USA the Electoral College format means if you get one more vote than your opponent in CA then you get all their 55 EC votes. Neither of these systems lets a 3rd party in to split the two main parties. There is little to no appetite to change this in either countries either!!

[0762]

There's an age old saying that has endured the "passing of time" SCO and it is the "tweedledee" and "tweedledum" political scenario where we have currently a tweedledee Tory PM called Boris Johnson and suddenly we've returned to the tweedledum acceptable establishment Labour opposition leader called Sir Keir Starmer. All is not well in British politics although we are clearly back to this two party establishment status again.

[0762]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/indepth/w...spartandhp

This is an intriguing article, published by the Washington Post, that I'd say should be read by every interested Sb member (and others) because it is so accurate a comparison of political attitudes, timing and organisation between Germany and the UK. Two big statements from Herr Haber are "our Health authority was a well-oiled machine" and the other statement was "we are not fighting a war, this is a test of our humanity" - a "must read" article, it confirms a lotta stuff that has been said on this OP. It's the potential outcome/loss of lives in the UK that disturbs me greatly!!

[hibeejim21]

The UK essentially suffers from the same problem the USA has - two party politics!!.  I know there are more parties in the UK, but the Government is formed from either Labour or the Tories virtually everytime.  The Labour party spend far too much time on the left fringes of their policies, just like the Democrats are in danger of doing over here, and that has made them unelectable for a lot of ordinary people.  Of course this will never change in either country due to the way the votes are counted and seats allocated.  In the UK, FPTP doesn't give any credit to those parties in 2nd place etc, in the USA the Electoral College format means if you get one more vote than your opponent in CA then you get all their 55 EC votes.  Neither of these systems lets a 3rd party in to split the two main parties.  There is little to no appetite to change this in either countries either!!

Its not 2 party politics that's the problem. Its two parties and one style of politics, thats why Corbyn was genuinely a breath of fresh air when he first broke through. Even Blair was pretty much apeing tory policies by the end.

Very,very rarely have left wing politics won through in the UK. Or precisely England. Maybe Wilson in the 60s or Attlee after the war. Mostly post war they have returned right wing conservative governments via FPTP.

Change the electoral system and debate gets widened and people get more representation. But it goes against the 2 main parties interests.

[0762]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/columnist...spartandhp

Well no surprise there because British govt officials know how damaging the full accumulative figure of deaths will be.

[St Charles Owl]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/columnist...spartandhp

Well no surprise there because British govt officials know how damaging the full accumulative figure of deaths will be.

Same thing is happening here. In NY the Governor altered their death toll yesterday to reflect those who are only suspected of dying of the virus but where no test has confirmed this. I think this is something that a number of countries are probably seeing.

[spireitematt]

According to some people we can't criticise the Government or Johnson because they won the election and the argument and therefore we can let them do what they want. What next we going to get down on our knees and praise the oh 'glorious leader'.

Do people seriously think that the opposition and the electorate shouldn't hold them to account? Because that is a dangerous mentality to have.

[ritchiebaby]

I don't think for a minute that we should forget the mistakes made re the UK response to coronavirus, mainly in the lack of positive action in the early stages. The damage has been done and will be not be forgotten by right-minded people.

I can only quote 0762's motto - facta non verba - to describe my views on the subject.

[0762]

According to some people we can't criticise the Government or Johnson because they won the election and the argument and therefore we can let them do what they want. What next we going to get down on our knees and praise the oh 'glorious leader'.

Do people seriously think that the opposition and the electorate shouldn't hold them to account? Because that is a dangerous mentality to have.

Apparently their popularity has gone up Matt according to some OPs???? That is absolutely astounding and it reminds me of the current Trump position in the USA. This could be an alarming indicator for the future when we don't know how low this RW govt of charlatans could stoop to recover the economy on the back end of hammering the poor and vulnerable even more. I notice the Social Market Foundation (Tory, New New Labour, Libdem think tank) launched the first salvo in an attack on the incomes of the poorest in society to pay for this economic crisis, by attacking the "triple lock" protecting those receiving the state pension. These people unbelievably think that £175.20 pw (new state pension) or £134.25 pw (old SP) is too much and pensioners should "shoulder the burden" and, in the process, "sow the seeds" of intergenerational grievance which would allow the Tories and New New Labour to go after the rest of the poorest in society while their venture capitalist backers will reap huge profits and dividends as a result. And make no mistake, the NHS is being lined up, amid all the love-bombing by Tories, to be charitised and privatised to within an inch of its life. This crisis could well be just another opportunity grasped to steer the UK toward the desired goal of this charlatan British govt!!

[hibeejim21]

Tomorrows times is absolutely scathing about Boris's reaction to the virus. Apparently he skipped several COBRA meetings, ignored scientific advise and repeated warnings to order more PPE.

Starmer should be going full on attack tomorrow.