[hibeejim21]

That's the problem with 52/48. It doesn't solve anything as nearly half the country are pissed off either way.

Article 52 is economic suicide. May is going to have to find a way to make it looked like it happened to appease the thickos,but by the same notion keep as much of the UKs deal as poss.

I'm sure that xxxx Murdoch will help with that...

[spireitematt]

That's the problem with 52/48. It doesn't solve anything as nearly half the country are pissed off either way.

Article 52 is economic suicide. May is going to have to find a way to make it looked like it happened to appease the thickos,but by the same notion keep as much of the UKs deal as poss.

I'm sure that **** Murdoch will help with that...

You can't say that everyone who voted leave is a 'thicko'. No one knows if leaving the EU will be economic suicide they can only estimate or predict what will happen.

It's nearly two months since the vote and we can keep talking about it till the cows come home but at the end of the day its out of our hands and in the hands of the Government and they will make the final decision.

[hibeejim21]

Anyone who thinks the uks problems, re immigration and low wages is going to be solved by leaving the EU is just thick. And sorry those were the main reasons given.

If the hundreds of extra millions for the NHS a month turn up I might relent on that. But the xxxx have already admitted they lied on that score.

[St Charles Owl]

Anyone who thinks the uks problems, re immigration and low wages is going to be solved by leaving the EU is just thick. And sorry those were the main reasons given.

If the hundreds of extra millions for the NHS a month turn up I might relent on that. But the **** have already admitted they lied on that score.

I know a lot of people who voted to leave, and very few used these issues as the main reason. I said at the time, the problem with the EU and the Remain campaign was that they were pretty much unable to give any positive reasons why voters should have voted to remain and they spent an awful amount of air time refuting the claims being made by the other side, which in the end seemed to mean the leave campaigns message stayed at the forefront of peoples minds and the Remain campaigns true message got lost.

[spireitematt]

The way I see it is both campaigns used scare tactics. The remain side didn't give any reasons to why we should stay in the EU but they just scaremongered. Yes the Leave campaign lied also and they shouldn't have promised any money for anything. As for immigration we've always had immigration in Britain before we joined the EU and after and it will continue. As for low wages nothing will change on that in the EU or out.

I think deep down a lot of people's minds were made up before the campaign even started. I read an article the other day that people living in the South of England and London blame the North for Brexit as a lot of Northern towns and cities voted Leave but apparently the majority of the South of England voted leave where as London voted remain.

Also you have to look at the age groups as well. People aged 50+ were more likely to vote than 18-21 year olds. 18-21 year olds had the lowest turnout and only complained and kicked up a fuss when the result didn't go the way they expected it to go but had they go out and voted the result could have been different. Look at it this way why do the parties seem to target the older people with free bus passes, pensions etc its because they are more likely to vote and they will vote for the party which appeals to them. If more young people got out and voted then the parties would target and appeal to young people and try and get there votes but because they don't the parties don't bother.

Young people feel disillusioned with politics as they feel they are all the same and that nothing changes but look what Jeremy Corbyn has done he has got young people interested as he is interacting with them and he appeals to them as he's different and unorthodox and wants change but the establishment don't like that as they are scared and the PLP want rid of him. The reason why he's struggling is because the media, his own MPs have undermined him from day one instead of getting behind him properly and all working together and he can't be bought either.

[Ska'dForLife-WBA]

Young people feel disillusioned with politics as they feel they are all the same and that nothing changes but look what Jeremy Corbyn has done he has got young people interested as he is interacting with them and he appeals to them as he's different and unorthodox and wants change but the establishment don't like that as they are scared and the PLP want rid of him. The reason why he's struggling is because the media, his own MPs have undermined him from day one instead of getting behind him properly and all working together and he can't be bought either.

Nope, the reason why he's struggling is because he's an incompetent fantasist who delivers platitudes instead of policies. Which is also the reason why the PLP want rid of him, and why huge swathes of the public want rid of him, and why the Tory Party are dancing an ecstatic jig, hoping he stays put and continues exactly what he's currently doing.

[St Charles Owl]

Young people feel disillusioned with politics as they feel they are all the same and that nothing changes but look what Jeremy Corbyn has done he has got young people interested as he is interacting with them and he appeals to them as he's different and unorthodox and wants change but the establishment don't like that as they are scared and the PLP want rid of him. The reason why he's struggling is because the media, his own MPs have undermined him from day one instead of getting behind him properly and all working together and he can't be bought either.

Nope, the reason why he's struggling is because he's an incompetent fantasist who delivers platitudes instead of policies.  Which is also the reason why the PLP want rid of him, and why huge swathes of the public want rid of him, and why the Tory Party are dancing an ecstatic jig, hoping he stays put and continues exactly what he's currently doing.

Spireitematt, I think you are too young to remember when Thatcher was PM and the Labour Party made themselves virtually unelectable by trotting out a bunch of leaders and other key politicians who were too left wing (or at least pervcieved to be) to be elected. Corbyn reminds me of those leaders, whether it's Michael Foot or Neil Kinnock, honorable men but not PM material in the end. Over here Bernie Sanders is the same, loved by the younger generation against his establishment rival in Hillary, but ultimately probably not electable in a general election.

Back to the referendum, it's amazing how remain voters blamed the older members of society for not understanding the true meaning of the EU and said the younger generations were the ones who will suffer with this result in the future, yet had the younger generations voted in the same numbers as the older generations then the result would have been reversed!!

[hibeejim21]

Anyone who thinks the uks problems, re immigration and low wages is going to be solved by leaving the EU is just thick. And sorry those were the main reasons given.

If the hundreds of extra millions for the NHS a month turn up I might relent on that. But the **** have already admitted they lied on that score.

I know a lot of people who voted to leave, and very few used these issues as the main reason.  I said at the time, the problem with the EU and the Remain campaign was that they were pretty much unable to give any positive reasons why voters should have voted to remain and they spent an awful amount of air time refuting the claims being made by the other side, which in the end seemed to mean the leave campaigns message stayed at the forefront of peoples minds and the Remain campaigns true message got lost.

What were their reasons then SCO ? The polls showed the reasons I gave as being the main drive behind brexit.

I keep coming back to this,but even if the benefits of staying in the EU were not presented well then the alternative was based on a pack of lies.

Already the pound is down against just about everything,inflation is rising and manufacturers facing higher prices. Remember the UK is primarily a service industry these days and one heavily reliant on imports particularly food.

Rocky times ahead.

---

Young people feel disillusioned with politics as they feel they are all the same and that nothing changes but look what Jeremy Corbyn has done he has got young people interested as he is interacting with them and he appeals to them as he's different and unorthodox and wants change but the establishment don't like that as they are scared and the PLP want rid of him. The reason why he's struggling is because the media, his own MPs have undermined him from day one instead of getting behind him properly and all working together and he can't be bought either.

Nope, the reason why he's struggling is because he's an incompetent fantasist who delivers platitudes instead of policies.  Which is also the reason why the PLP want rid of him, and why huge swathes of the public want rid of him, and why the Tory Party are dancing an ecstatic jig, hoping he stays put and continues exactly what he's currently doing.

I don't actually have a problem with a lot of corbyns policies,indeed in a lot of cases he has been proven right. More that he is just a really poor leader,orator and organiser.

The labour party is done. Its core vote is now split,and middle England has never really voted for it for it anyway. No matter who is in charge in 2020 it will face wipe out unless the tories spectacularly xxxx it up.

[0762]

That's the problem with 52/48. It doesn't solve anything as nearly half the country are pissed off either way.

Article 52 is economic suicide. May is going to have to find a way to make it looked like it happened to appease the thickos,but by the same notion keep as much of the UKs deal as poss.

I'm sure that **** Murdoch will help with that...

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/thi...spartandhp

It appears that Article 50 and forcing a Brexit withdrawal may never happen if this legal challenge takes effect and I'd chuckle if parliament was forced to vote on it in the knowledge that, contrary to the result of this protest referendum vote, a huge percentage of parliamentarians are opposed to Brexit and implementing it in the first place!!!

[spireitematt]

Young people feel disillusioned with politics as they feel they are all the same and that nothing changes but look what Jeremy Corbyn has done he has got young people interested as he is interacting with them and he appeals to them as he's different and unorthodox and wants change but the establishment don't like that as they are scared and the PLP want rid of him. The reason why he's struggling is because the media, his own MPs have undermined him from day one instead of getting behind him properly and all working together and he can't be bought either.

Nope, the reason why he's struggling is because he's an incompetent fantasist who delivers platitudes instead of policies.  Which is also the reason why the PLP want rid of him, and why huge swathes of the public want rid of him, and why the Tory Party are dancing an ecstatic jig, hoping he stays put and continues exactly what he's currently doing.

Spireitematt, I think you are too young to remember when Thatcher was PM and the Labour Party made themselves virtually unelectable by trotting out a bunch of leaders and other key politicians who were too left wing (or at least pervcieved to be) to be elected.  Corbyn reminds me of those leaders, whether it's Michael Foot or Neil Kinnock, honorable men but not PM material in the end.  Over here Bernie Sanders is the same, loved by the younger generation against his establishment rival in Hillary, but ultimately probably not electable in a general election.

Back to the referendum, it's amazing how remain voters blamed the older members of society for not understanding the true meaning of the EU and said the younger generations were the ones who will suffer with this result in the future, yet had the younger generations voted in the same numbers as the older generations then the result would have been reversed!!

Yes I am too young to remember when Thatcher was PM. Labour can't be identical to the Tories like we were in 2015 under Ed. We need to be centre of left to have any chance of getting elected but at the moment the leadership contest is between Corbyn and Owen Smith and it looks like Corbyn will win again. There is talk of Miliband (Dave) coming back.