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Stanley Milgram and The Windrush
#1
Back in 1961 I think Stanley Milgram devised a psychological experiment that showed how far human beings would take their obedience to authority figures. Fifty seven years on Windrushgate is proving how unwilling people are to rebel against authority.

Milgram's experiment demonstrated how volunteers assigned the role of teacher were prepared to continue administering apparent electric shocks to apparent learners upon the instructions given to them by researchers. They continued correcting wrong answers with increasingly high voltages despite the screams coming from the other side of the partition which separated them.

In The Home Office apparently ordinary men and women thought it right to send out letters threatening deportation to people who had been brought to this country even before Milgram conducted his experiment. Some of these people have been denied NHS treatment, lost jobs and had their driving licences removed. They've become non-people. Ordinary men and women in The Home Office have colluded in this policy. They've seen the letters. They knew what was happening. They did nothing! EVEN when protests were voiced they colluded.

Those same people would no doubt be appalled by the clerk in the death camps listing the possessions removed from those about to be gassed .......... but their own lives would have been in no danger had they spoken up and yet they chose to obey.

It is frightening. My mum used to nurse in a hospital for what at the time were known as Mentally Subnormal people. At one point it became psychiatrically fashionable to administer shock treatment, electro-convulsive therapy, was that its name? The patients facing it, though often childlike, knew what was about to happen and were terrified ....... really, really terrified of this procedure and begged not to be taken. My mum, who had left school at fourteen yet embarked on this quite demanding nurse training, had the courage to say, "This is cruel. I will have no part of it!" She did not have the power to stop it, but she protested and refused to collude. She saw that these patients had no prospect of recovery or real improvement, said so, and she kept her job too! I read about The Home Office and I am so bloody proud of her.

Windrushgate is a lesson for all us. If we see something wrong we should speak up. If something seems wrong and unjust let's question it. I can't remember the last time anything made me quite so furious. I just wanted to say it out loud.
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#2
IMO this is just another stigma to add to the list re the 'other side' of Great Britain's governance - the 'dark side'. There are many similar stories to add to this one incl the injustices practised by the British establishment against women's rights, the LGBT community, known communists (and god help you if serving in the armed forces) to name but a few 'black marks' on Great Britain and the Empire! One story that always appealed to me was the WW1 rebellion by British soldiers in France that was eventually quashed and most of the offenders executed - IMO these guys were heroes fighting against a system that deemed that upper crust toffs could send thousands n thousands of British soldiers to certain slaughter or life changing injuries if they were lucky. There are some great books written on the subject and this 'protest' that cost the lives of some very young soldiers who were caught up in the politics and hardship of the first world war.
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#3
Sadly 0762 I have to agree. Once a person or a group is regarded as OTHER then all forms of injustice are possible. And even "good" people simply acquiesce.

We have to change. We have to have the courage to trust our own moral compass and speak out.

Do I think it will happen? Do I think Brechin City will win all their remaining games?
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#4
Aye! It is indeed an ideological viewpoint set in a 'minefield' of doubt and uncertainty, sad to say. However, goodness and righteousness still 'shine brightly' like huge beacons for others to follow! God help us if that trait ever falters and ends!
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#5
As david lammy said in the house yesterday " a day of national shame". Nowhere else to hide either,its 100% down to our current PMs actions in the home office.
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#6
Yes Jim, you and David Lammy are so right. Mrs May's reforms started this off ........... but in all the years since no one seems to have stood up and questioned them. Did no one say, "Did you really mean people who arrived on The Windrush with their mum and dad to be threatened with repatriation all these years later?"

Mrs May goes to church every Sunday, so probably do some of those sending letters out from The Home Office. Do they perhaps divorce the collection plate from all their actions during the week? Does Communion serve as absolution for all those lives they blight during the week?
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#7
The home office whistle blower told the guardian that they destroyed the windrush immigrants landing cards in 2010 (and ending any chance of proving the dates of arrival) and then forced Windrush-generation migrants to try and prove their status, threatening them with deportation and stripping them of their rights along the way to keep the immigration figures down.

This is the kind of shit we have ushered in with the brexit debate,and to appease the racism of UKIP. Its xxxx outrageous and more than apologies need to be issued for this. Labour need to push for resignations.
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#8
(17-04-2018, 15:47)Devongone Wrote: Yes Jim, you and David Lammy are so right. Mrs May's reforms started this off ........... but in all the years since no one seems to  have stood up and questioned them. Did no one say, "Did you really mean people who arrived on The Windrush with their mum and dad to be threatened with repatriation all these years later?"

Mrs May goes to church every Sunday, so probably do some of those sending letters out from The Home Office. Do they perhaps divorce the collection plate from all their actions during the week? Does Communion serve as absolution for all those lives they blight during the week?

Does Maggie Thatcher and her regular Sunday church visits with Dennis 'ring a bell' as well Devongone eh? Seems to be a common theme for these 'christian people'. Even Tony Bliar was 'at it' with his conversion to Roman Catholicism which many devout RCs condemned 'out of hand! Downright hypocrisy 'comes to mind' re these shameless people!
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#9
The PM, Saint Theresa May, now defending herself against Corbyn's attack on her Callous governance by insisting that the start of the Windrush fiasco was under the auspices of a Labour Home Secretary. Oh aye Theresa and we will just ignore the length of time that you continued to take full advantage of this initial situation 'under your watch' until it has finally 'come to light'! What a shameless hypocrite who has apologised for a second time in a couple of days but IMO no real sincerity detected in either of these 'acts of contrition'.
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#10
May has form for misleading the house. Labour policy in 1999 made those cards unnecessary to prove the windrush immigrants status. It was only her reforms in 2014 that made them vital again. They changed the law on immigration and this Tory change, initiated by May, deliberately weakened the rights of British subjects and brought in hostile policies aimed at attacking them.

But aye its all labours fault. Arsehole of a woman.
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