[hibeejim21]

We aren't talking about a firm of plumbers here ffs

Go to page one where the introduction is from the president of the ECA, unless he is just fabricating the signature on his own organisations audit of course.

[0762]

Is this not just another example of the evolved 'distrust' of the EU, esp down south, generated by the RW press (and others with a set agenda against the EU) who have 'stoked up' a dislike of the EU for the past 20-30 years if one was being frank about it and it conveniently misses out the role of successive failed British governments in many contentious brexit issues that certain parliamentarians should really 'carry the can' for. IMO it is a noticeable evolved 'culture' amongst a significant part of the voting population in England and it never goes away! In other words, 'point the finger' at the nasty old EU whenever the opportunity arises and ignore the culpable activities of shit British governments!!

[theo_luddite]

He can sign what the hell he likes, that is nothing more than a marketing document. If they had behaved like a bunch of professional plumbers rather than a bunch of bodgers there wouldn't have been a need for a Brexit vote.

[0762]

Aye! And that is just your opinion pal. The EU may not be perfect, I accept that fact, but unsubstantiated slurs on practise and stats, data etc really go 'beyond the pale' and ties in with this negative culture I described in my previous thread.
Back to the brexit topic and here is the best comment/metaphor of the week from an ex senior civil servant, Sir Michael Donnelly, used as a rebuke to comments made by that brexit Tory numpty, Liam Fox re alternative trade - 'It is like refusing a three course meal and replacing it with a packet of crisps' lol! Touche and it is 'high time' that many people within our population started to wizen up re the negative implications of brexit.

[hibeejim21]

Is this not just another example of the evolved 'distrust' of the EU, esp down south, generated by the RW press (and others with a set agenda against the EU) who have 'stoked up' a dislike of the EU for the past 20-30 years if one was being frank about it and it conveniently misses out the role of successive failed British governments in many contentious brexit issues that certain parliamentarians should really 'carry the can' for. IMO it is a noticeable evolved 'culture' amongst a significant part of the voting population in England and it never goes away! In other words, 'point the finger' at the nasty old EU whenever the opportunity arises and ignore the culpable activities of shit British governments!!

Is it any wonder when you have tory politicians in parliament shouting that the EU haven't had their figures audited for 20 years and the right wing press echoing them ?? Absolute lying bastards.

---

He can sign what the hell he likes, that is nothing more than a marketing document. If they had behaved like a bunch of professional plumbers rather than a bunch of bodgers there wouldn't have been a need for a Brexit vote.

The only reason for a brexit vote was to appease divisions in the tory party and suspicion of johnny foreigner on dear old englands high streets.

Just admit it.

[spireitematt]

Is this not just another example of the evolved 'distrust' of the EU, esp down south, generated by the RW press (and others with a set agenda against the EU) who have 'stoked up' a dislike of the EU for the past 20-30 years if one was being frank about it and it conveniently misses out the role of successive failed British governments in many contentious brexit issues that certain parliamentarians should really 'carry the can' for. IMO it is a noticeable evolved 'culture' amongst a significant part of the voting population in England and it never goes away! In other words, 'point the finger' at the nasty old EU whenever the opportunity arises and ignore the culpable activities of shit British governments!!

Is it any wonder when you have tory politicians in parliament shouting that the EU haven't had their figures audited for 20 years and the right wing press echoing them ??      Absolute lying bastards.

---

He can sign what the hell he likes, that is nothing more than a marketing document. If they had behaved like a bunch of professional plumbers rather than a bunch of bodgers there wouldn't have been a need for a Brexit vote.

The only reason for a brexit vote was to appease divisions in the tory party and suspicion of johnny foreigner on dear old englands high streets.

Just admit it.

People voted for Brexit for different things Hibeejim21. If MPs in the main parties didn't like the result then they shouldn't have given us the bloody referendum! If you don't like the answer then don't ask the bloody question! The Tories won the election in 2015 because Cameron promised in the manifesto to give the British people a referendum on membership of the EU and when the result turned out to be leave he buggered off.

Years before the referendum happened companies in Britain were leaving and moving to Europe to set up business because it was cheaper which meant jobs here went and unemployment rose. Cadburys is an example when Kraft took them over they moved to Poland.

If you are so sure Scotland will leave the UK and rejoin the EU then what you worried about?

[0762]

Exactly! Nothing to worry about because the Scottish economy will thrive once we acquire self-determination in the year 2019 (by my estimation and that of many supporters of Scottish self-determination). However, UK trade will not suddenly cease following Scot indy 2 and a positive post brexit UK trade outcome is still favoured by all 'interested parties' north and south of the border. IMO the tories/govt are gonna leave and f### up. We prepare and wait for that final shambles to unfold and eventual alternative British govt to take over in a political culture that sees massive division in the mainstream unionist political parties while stability and pragmatism still prevails with solid Scottish voting support for the SNP and an SNP govt that is still highly regarded north of the border and to the disdain of these shameless unionists and their associated press/media who have tried every shameless political tactic/slur 'under the sun' to break the stranglehold/solid Scottish backing for a party that has the interests of the Scottish people at the core of it's political manifesto!

[hibeejim21]

"People voted for Brexit for different things Hibeejim21"


But mostly xenophobic and nationalist 'things'. It's a total myth that the average Briton is upset by EU rules. They're told to be by the press, and so they attach their much more diffuse hostility to the EU to rules that they don't even understand, some of the arguments and figures presented on here as a case for brexit have been absolute xxxx nonsense.

Most British folk i've met just want what's pretty much the norm in the EU: a mixed capitalist economy with fairly high public spending. Its the tories who don't want that, they and their backers want a move to a unregulated,asian style economy. Brexit won't solve immigration either, Given our demography and economy, we'll still have high figures, just in increasing numbers from outside europe.

Brexit is a total con. The vast,vast majority of the ills of the UK were caused by UK governments rather than the EU. Especially the tory one.

[0762]

The guy who still 'gets ma craw' even now is David Cameron, one of the worst British PMs in living memory and a selfish one 'to boot'! He was a major player in the shameless unionist lies, similar to the shameless lies/deceptions of brexit, that were fed to the Scottish voting population in Scot referendum year 2014 and then had the gall to set up that ill-conceived EU referendum bill after not even honouring a min devo-max settlement as promised in late 2014-early 2015 - the shit British state playing 'funny buggers' on the promises that were laid out in their pre-voting stance (the infamous 3 amigos scenario). He had no right to even go near that Tory political folly but he foolishly did it anyway and 'slipped on a banana skin' in the process - a total imbecile and inadvertent political saboteur who has created a major problem and division throughout the country!!! I hate this man/coward with a passion and he just had to be a toerag!

[spireitematt]

"People voted for Brexit for different things Hibeejim21"


But mostly xenophobic and nationalist 'things'.  It's a total myth that the average Briton is upset by EU rules. They're told to be by the press, and so they attach their much more diffuse hostility to the EU to rules that they don't even understand, some of the arguments and figures presented on here as a case for brexit have been absolute **** nonsense.

Most British folk i've met just want what's pretty much the norm in the EU: a mixed capitalist economy with fairly high public spending. Its the tories who don't want that, they and their backers want a move to a unregulated,asian style economy.  Brexit won't solve immigration either, Given our demography and economy, we'll still have high figures, just in increasing numbers from outside europe.

Brexit is a total con. The vast,vast majority of the ills of the UK were caused by UK governments rather than the EU. Especially the tory one.

Like I said everyone voted Leave for different reasons, people vote for different reasons in a General Election, you are just generalising what people voted for. If the result had been Remain 52% to 48% would you have told the people who voted Leave to put up or shut up? If it had been Remain then the result would have had to be respected by the people because that's democracy, obviously you would have one or two individuals who would bleat on about having another referendum but the result would stand and Cameron would still be in power with a small majority.

If the referendum was Leave 60%-40% or even 70%-30% would you have respected it then? Also the referendum back in 2016 if that was a General Election the result would have been called a landslide.

When the UK joined the EEC (Common Market) back in 1972/73 without a referendum under Ted Heath and the Tories the British public were not consulted until 2 years later when Harold Wilson gave the British public a referendum on it and that referendum was about a Common Market not a political union. In 1992 we didn't sign Maastricht but in 2007 Labour and Brown signed the Treaty of Lisbon without a referendum when they should have consulted the British people and asked them did they want to join the European Union or stay in the Single Market but they didn't. If they had consulted the British people would we have had Brexit? Probably not.

Scotland are Nationalistic aren't they? Scottish people are proud to be Scottish? and Scottish people are proud to fly their flag? and they vote for a party called the Scottish National Party do they not? So why can Scotland be nationalistic but no one else can.