[St Charles Owl]

Yep! There's a strong reference from US political analysts to a significant proportion of the Trump vote comprising 'angry white American men'! Are there really so many of these kinda people around in the USA who have rendered true values and reason useless in the face of such crass political campaigning???  It's an absolute travesty of the common good that really should've won through esp v this kinda individual who can't even present himself properly without uttering some kinda controversial or unthinking remark  - lacking proper articulation and humility!  Obama's persona alone places Trump so far down the scale of reputation that any comparison is a total 'walkover' for the outgoing president and DT aint gonna change it any time soon - he's not bright enough and 'what you see is what you'll sadly get'!

The short answer to your question is yes, there are certainly enough of them!!

I do think the voting habits of Americans is a very complex subject but its not dissimilar in some ways to the UK. For starters, there are millions of Americans who strongly identify as Republicans, and Republicans only!! Their party could put up anyone, and as long as they are running with the byline Republican under their name that is where the vote goes. The same exists in equal number of the Democrat side as well. This is so similar in the UK, Labor win the inner city vote not because of any particualr policy or strong leader but because those constituents would never dream of voting for anyone else, as a lot of Conservative or even SNP supporters do for their party as well.

Therefore like in the UK, most elections are won and lost in key battleground constituencies or states, and this is where Trump over achieved. This election was not won in California, New York or Texas, the three biggest states with the biggest Electoral College votes, those states went exactly the way predicted and were never going to be any different. You can add to that about 40 other states where the result is almost pre-ordained because of the paragraph above. So we were left with some very tight states that ultimately Trump won to reach the 270 mark he needed. And this is where we go back to your question - these states, virtually all of them, are blue collar, working class, traditional industries and predominantly white states. We are talking here about Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin and Ohio, states who have thrived in the past on big industries such as steel, mining and cars, all industries that have suffered not due to US policies necessarily but due to the globalization of those industries and the influx of cheap imports of the products these states produced. This has seen these states really suffer for a while now, and they have seen many politicians come through there every 4 years promising to make it better when in reality there isn't a whole lot that can be done to resurrect those manufacturing jobs!! We saw it ourselves first hand, I worked in the steel industry in Sheffield in the 80s, Scotland has seen the same, those jobs do not come back!!

So we get to 2016 and along comes Donald Trump, a successful billionaire businessman who is shouting about the need for American to be great again, for the jobs in manufacturing to come back but he is also telling people what he will do to actually make this happen (something the Democrats didn't do). He will rip up NAFTA to stop companies moving to Mexico, he will get tough on China to stop the cheap imports, he will impose tariffs on companies that move jobs, he will build a wall, he will stop immigrants coming in to take some of our jobs or killing us etc etc etc. And lets be right, he's a self made billionaire, he didn't rip us off as a politician to make his money, he made it the hard way by grafting!!! Now imagine the scene in these states, unemployed workers or manufacturing employees reassigned to crap jobs in McDonalds or WalMart, house prices that have slumped, population shrinking and the sight of other states apparently booming such as liberal California or Illinois or New York and as we saw it was enough for them to say "This guy is different, he is not a politician, he is not the establishment and he knows how to fix things and make money, he might be able to get some good jobs for us, this is our man!!" and hey presto, Trump won all these states and this is what carried the election!!

These people are not stupid, they are not even Republicans in a lot of cases, but they are disenfranchised by both mainstream parties, they are living from check to check in run down areas, they are struggling financially and as you say they are definitely angry that they have been left behind while others are doing so well. So while we may see that Trump is an idiot, they see him as at this moment in time the best choice to maybe, just maybe, deliver on his promises when others haven't and he may just make their life great again!!! I don't blame them for thinking that, they don't like the man anymore than we do in a lot of cases but the democrats, and particularly Hillary did not give them the attention they deserve, nor the solutions they wanted to hear even if she would have done better for them. She did not visit Wisconsin once during the whole process!!!! I am not advocating they are wrong or right, but if we put ourselves in their shoes for a second we can maybe have a bit of understanding where they are coming from.

[0762]

That's a good summary of the unfolding US election events SCO. I was always familiar with the 'key states' issue that you mention and yep, these states certainly tie in with the 'angry white American men' philosophy presented by many astute US political analysts.
I'd swap the word 'stupid' for a more apt word for their desperate way of thinking with nowt to lose - naive!  As one would put it succinctly - beware the angry white rich boy/actor bearing gifts and false promises! That will be proved beyond all doubt during what I reckon will be one of the shortest presidential terms of office in US political history - another record in US politics that will tie in nicely with that recent all-time winning populist vote for the loser of a US presidential election - bizarre!

[St Charles Owl]

Yes, naive would work as well. I suppose the point I am trying to make is that a lot of Trump voters are ordinary people who are wrongly being accused of being racists because they voted for him, and I think thats grossly unfair. A lot of well educated people voted for him and so did a fair few minorities. I just think one of the issues that we see now is the polarization of the population along political lines but the reality is that most people are just trying to get by and love him or hate him, Trump has given some hope to these voters who decided to take the chance that at least on this one issue he might actually be able to do something. I don't think he will be able to do half of what he says, but the same could be said for the democrats at the moment.

I also thing the populist vote is a misnomer because of the essentially 2 party system over here. The last 5 General Elections in the UK have seen 58%, 57%, 64%, 64% and 63% of the votes being cast for parties other than the winning one, so that is even more skewed than the GE here. The fact that there are multiple parties in the UK makes a difference of course but the overwhelming majority of voters voted for someone other than the winner.

[0762]

It maybe a misnomer in your opinion but it's still certainly an all-time US record where the loser has polled a record deficit number of votes from US citizens across the population spectrum to outmatch the eventual winner!! IMO it kinda exposes a certain weakness to the voting system used, particularly in a close election. Re the British voting system, don't get me started on that one! There have been calls for electoral reform for years because of the poor representation of certain political parties based on the decent voting numbers for that party. Nothing ever done and I think one of the main reasons for the status quo is because it suits the mainstream political parties 'down to the ground', particularly the toerags who I can't stand for various reasons incl their clear divisiveness, privilege and elitism that they embrace!!

[0762]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...inton.html

This is the latest 'twist' in this whole US presidential election fiasco. At last, somebody challenging the legitimacy of Trump as president with reference to the clear interferences that have been used during the election campaigning of Clinton and Trump. Well said John Lewis and I hope many other influential Americans, and others, 'jump in' to this criticism by a veteran politician and back him!! It's already noticeable how many Democrats AND Republican figures are backing these comments by Lewis. A good indication of a unified USA? More like a nation in turmoil and so it should be after past highly questionable events in 2016!

[St Charles Owl]

We are seeing comments like this most days from someone in the Democratic Party but still very little in the way of any real criticism from any Republicans. Trump obviously took offence at these comments and tweeted to hit back and this drew out a few Repubicans to defend the record of John Lewis but still nothing really about what Lewis actually said!!

The Republican's control all branches of government and will for at least a couple of years. While they may not have the best guy at the top of the tree they will do everything they can to make sure they retain that power, so they may occasionally criticize something Trump says or does, they will not rock the boat too much for fear of losing that power.

[0762]

It's a pity that the 'vested interest' tendency and megalomaniac  mentality prevails because one thing is clear and that is the fact that Trump never had a great affiliation to the Republican Party anyway and should never have been allowed anywhere near the presentation of their formal 'reputable' candidacy after all his shenanigans of attacking Republicans left, right and centre. Your guess is prob as good as mine re how many enemies he has within the RP alone but they definitely exist - you 'reap what you sow' and Trump has definitely created a lotta hatred towards him and his generally crass, outrageous behaviour, some of it even bordering on sedition! I'm sure he believes he can now walk away from the shit/political games that he brought on himself! IMO the repercussions will come back to haunt him 'big time' and he'll deserve it when it eventually comes in whatever form!

[St Charles Owl]

Trump has flip-flopped on so many issues over the years and yes in the past was considered a Democrat not a Republican. But as per his interview on Oprah a few years ago he also recognized that if he were to run the easiest way to the office was to appeal to the Republican masses who tend to vote like lemmings following each other off a cliff!!!! As I said before they are not stupid, but they are predictable and completely devoid of debate on many topics!!

[hibeejim21]

Trump is not smart. Half the time, at least, he is just talking out of his arse. That's why he is so unpredictable and why he contradicts himself on a regular basis.

It's hard to believe that there is no entanglement with Putin and Russia either,considering what went down on that election trail. I think very much he is putins pal and they are planning a trade war with the far east.

From a UK perspective I firmly believe the tories under cruella are softening up the NHS for a deal with US private health companies as part of a brexit trade package.

[0762]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2016-37918242

I agree and don't think Trump is politically 'bright' at all - that's a huge concern!! Also here are seven ways Trump could 'change the world' but IMO not for the better! The guy is a big-mouthed troublemaker and an irrational future US president 'to boot'! God help us if the US system of gov doesn't apply some form of strict scrutiny and control of this man's extreme political actions! Also watching Trump giving positive vibes re strong future US-UK trade links and who is he talking to? None other than that shameless little toerag #######, Michael Gove!!!! This little twerp shouldn't be allowed anywhere near an interview on national tv!!!